Hi all, I’ve been doing a lot of cycling training/workouts the last years and have struggled to do the same quality training outdoors than indoors. Because it’s just hard to really execute workouts outdoor due to traffic etc. Especially since I don’t feel like doing the same roads every time.
So I’ve been planning to build a site where you can plot your intervals/workouts on specific sections of a route. So that you’re not triggered to do a vo2max effort whilst you’re in a crowded area or for example on a descent. And similarly that you can do your 10m tempo effort on this nice uninterrupted stretch of tarmac!
I’ve been talking to Garmin and unfortunately there is no way to have workout steps triggered by gps location. So the best we can do is distance-based. For for that to work the user needs to start recording the ride at the exact start of the route for it to be in sync. Also, he cannot deviate from the planned route.
This has obvious drawbacks. If the user records before or after the start of the route or if there are roadworks then the workout steps are triggered at the wrong place.
So I’m doubting whether to pursue this or not.
What are the thoughts of this community. Do you like the idea and would you be ok with the drawbacks? Perhaps some ideas to overcome it?
ps. David, if you find this post inappropriate, feel free to remove. Just figured that more people here are struggling with doing intervals outside.
This is where I would set up the interval session via either Garmin or trainingpeaks, and have the warm-up as an open lap which will go on until I press the lap button.
Garmin has segments as well and it can be triggered on the watch / head unit. That is triggered via GPS location.
So I’m guessing that you now also want that trigger as a way to start the workout? I think it’s doable - maybe have 2 head units. One for gps signal. One for workout steps.
Not sure if you can change data field pages when the segment is triggered tho.
Isn’t this where you just improvise? During a few recent rides in low-traffic few-intersections areas in The Netherlands I threw in a few longer high intensity efforts with short breaks.
Even if I’d get location-based intervals, that still won’t know about traffic situations where I have to suspend intensity briefly (much of what I did was on bike paths and I didn’t want to overtake people at excessive speeds for example).
But OK, I guess this is why my FTP hasn’t really changed much recently. (But also, lots of PRs on some recent rides, so I do think I’m getting somewhere…)
As @Nik_Om_Cinderella_Ri mentions this can be done with Garmin segments. To identify the type of interval, name the segment after it such as “VO2max Segment” os “10m Tempo Segment”.
I may be wrong but BestBikeSplit has the “power course”, which guides you to hold a specific power on a route, based on GPS location. This sounds very similar to what you described.
I have used Intervals.icu distance based workouts to create a similar scenario (particularly to pace myself when trying to PR a segment) but as you said it is necessary to hit start at an exact location in order for the plan to work correctly.
Personally I would really like to be able to create power courses based on existing segments and possibly play with some parameters to see how that impacts result.
MyWindSock also has something similar.
I think it’s a cool idea. Often I will go for a long ride that has ‘some’ structure to do within it, but the only way I can be sure I can execute the structure is to repeat it on the same stretch of road, usually a climb.
As you rightly say the execution is the tricky part if it’s not possible to initiate the lap based on your location. Maybe you could use waypoints on the route, and the waypoint is a signal to start the interval? So the workout steps are manually initiated, but the waypoint alerts you that you are at the right place to start.
Seems our riding is very similar. We’re obviously getting stronger and can hold higher power for longer and repeatedly. My understanding is that as long as we’re getting the work in, results will follow and that is working for me too. If I hit a bunch of Intervals during a ride or hold a higher continuous power at a Threshold or VO2 max and put a nice burn in my legs, I don’t think they particularly care if I was following a builder or not.
Time in the saddle and challenging ourselves to generate adaptations is what these builders are about. One doesn’t have to use one to accomplish that.
Thanks for all the replies. @BiciMapas re: segments we have indeed considered this but found it too much of a workaround @Zen_Turtle re: bestbikesplit have also considered and tried but it has a minimum of ‘splits’ that is way higher than what i would typically need in a workout. but worth digging in deeper, maybe I’ll reach out to them @James_Eastwood_Socks thanks, yes i think with the current capabilities this might be the best way to do this. Have gps-based prompts that instruct the user to press ‘lap’ to trigger the next workout step. Not ideal still but would work. @Jcmiii agree and disagree. Weird thing is that I’m typically getting faster (ftp/max power etc) during by winter season when i’m doing less hours. Why? I believe cause i’m only doing structured training then indoors. As soon as spring kicks in I start doing outdoor freerides and my fitness improves but not my ftp or max power numbers. I’ve tried (using Join) to do structured training outside but then found it so frustrating that i’m constantly prompted to do efforts that are not possible at that particular stretch of road.
Thanks again, I’ll investigate the prompt to trigger next step route further.
In my experience, outdoor structured workouts have some complexity to do as finding and having access to roads or trails that have the conditions needed is not easy. From a guideline I wrote to use segments for interval training: Step 1: Finding the Right Road or Trail Section
The first step in using Garmin Segments for interval training is identifying a suitable road or trail for your intervals. Here’s what to look for:
Terrain : For power-based intervals, choose a relatively flat and consistent section. This allows you to maintain steady power output. However, if you’re training for climbs, find a section with a steady incline.
Traffic : Select a section with minimal traffic, allowing you to focus on your intervals without distractions. A quiet road or trail is ideal.
Length : Make sure the section is long enough for your interval. For instance, if you plan a 20-minute Zone 4 interval, ensure that the segment can accommodate at least 20 minutes of uninterrupted riding.
An alternative I use is to track the Intensity Factor during the ride with a screen similar to this one
and I make sure that at the end of the ride, it is within the limits of the target training zone.
Another option is to have a screen with the Time in Zone data fields and make sure that at the end of the ride you spent the required time within the target training zone, something like this (shows heart rate zones, but would be the same idea with power zones):
(But also, lots of PRs on some recent rides, so I do think I’m getting somewhere…)
