I am struggling a bit to find proper training zones for rowing. I found these:
From training zones | thestumpyrower
However, these zones are based on % of 2k time trial.
Basing the zones out of those for rowing would probably skew the load calculation for the rowing activities.
Anyone have some good zones that could be used?
I’m not a fan of using HR zones to monitor my OTW rowing training load, given the variables that can impact HR during training….I lean into monitoring my Power (W) developed/maintained. That said, you may find this reference useful ( you may have to signup for his free newsletter to access) to answer your question: How to set up your heart rate training zones. (Premium access) - WH Chambers
The attached photo (available via an internet search) illustrates the authors adaptation for rowing of the 5 Zone Polarized Model in the literature by Dr. Seiler. The photo illustrates the author’s adaptation to a 185 bpm max HR.
Here are two other rowing references you may find useful…the first speaks mostly to monitoring Power, but has a reference to also monitoring HR (Coggan’s model)… https://analytics.rowsandall.com/2017/01/26/rowing-with-a-power-meter-and-rowsandall-com/. The second is more specific to HR…. https://analytics.rowsandall.com/2016/12/28/whats-your-maximum-heart-rate/
When I was rowing (a lot, and pretty fast too), I usually used a combination of pace/500m and HR and feel to guide my training. I found that because respiration rates were always some multiple of stroke rate, and those influence HR, my HR wasn’t a great indicator because sometimes it would feel easier to go faster (getting more O2).
So how did you find your AT (FTP, LTHR and pace at AT) for rowing - and which zones did you use for power, pace and hr?
Although I subscribe more to Power (W) to measure/guide my workouts, and being somewhat data nerdish, I too decided to try to determine my Maximum Heart Rate (MHR) more accurately so I have another data point to monitor my training (especially now that I’ve turned 68 
). As of late, I have taken my test data and rolled it into the 5 Zone model.
Prior to last year, I had been using a MHR based on the formula: “[ 207 – 0.7 more precise formula, adjusted for people over the age of 40” (https://theathleteblog.com/calculate-maximum-heart-rate/). This formula recommended my MHR should be 160 BPM which I’d traditionally used for years.
Additional research (https://analytics.rowsandall.com/…/whats-your-maximum…/; https://rowalong.com/calculating-maxhr/) affirmed to me the most accurate method to determine one’s MHR is an erg-based performance test…one designed using an erg rower. I chose Rowing Australia’s 7 step protocol, leaving out the VO2 max and Blood Lactate testing:
Note: The test protocol states to use a C2 rowing machine, but I’ve found most rowing ergs operate on the same Power Curve (math is math)…ergs like the Waterrower just shows more Force and Power generated than the C2 if the two ergs were to be reading the same stroke. A Waterrower 2k completion time used as the basis for selecting the test interval workloads should require close to the same relative effort as you would exert rowing a C2, just the Waterrower Power/Pace targets will read higher….thus, you just can’t mix or directly compare the two……
My impression of taking of the Australian MHR test was its basically a 7x4-minute sub-maximal interval workout with 1-minute rest intervals in between. The only kicker is the last (7th) 4-minute interval is at an all-out maximum effort…basically a constant-applied power 1k race that was preceded by a good sub-minimal 30-min interval warm-up whose targets were based on my most recent 2k race time. At the end, I wasn’t on the floor (close to it), but I was definitely gassed………
The attached results at the time recommend to me a new MHR of 168 BPM. Of interest, my HR recovered to 2x my Resting Rate (116/58) in 2 min, 49 sec after the test. This “test” was a fun warmup workout for the 60 min recovery row that I did following the test. I didn’t “earn” anything with the 8 BPM MHR increase, just a little more knowledge….and, data to play with…….
Thanks for the detailed response. As you state yourself, you tend to use Power (or Pace) on the rower to guide the training. Have you found any zone calculations using power and pace instead of MHR?
Ah, you have touched on the challenge I too still face. Rowing power zone definition doesn’t enjoy the same level of discussion and coverage as that of the triathlon sports. My readings to date point toward Coggan’s or Skiba’s writings and research, though they generally aren’t focused on rowing. I find people appear to either use their recommendations directly, or a percentage of them.
I did find one bike/rower erg power direct comparison study online (“Oxygen consumption and metabolic strain in rowing ergometer exercise” - published in the European Journal of Applied Physiology and Occupational Physiology · February 1986 -https://www.researchgate.net/publication/19430187_Oxygen_consumption_and_metabolic_strain_in_rowing_ergometer_exercise) that spoke of the efficiency of power production between the two. The following is quoted from the last paragraph of the summary of that paper (RE - Rowing Ergometer; BE - Bike Ergometer):
“VO2 of rowing was about 600 ml X min-1 higher than for bicycling in the submaximal stages for both groups. The VO2max of RE exercise was 2.6% higher than for oarsmen on BE, and the cyclists reached a greater VO2 on BE than the oarsmen. No differences were found between RE and BE exercise heart rate. The net work efficiency when rowing was 19% for both groups, experienced and inexperienced: when cycling it was 25% for cyclists and 23% for oarsmen.” I’m no scientist or exercise physiologist, but my interpretation of this study’s findings is their appears to be a 4-6% difference in Power production efficiency between erg rowing and biking with this test group.
What to do with those findings? ….I’m not sure…maybe adjust the well-used cycling power zone watts down by 5%? …I don’t know. I’m not that smart or knowledgeable to advise, but my guess is you would be ok to use the same Power zones as for cycling (Coggan is what I found on the Rowsandall.com site) as you continue your research ……my research also continues….
JUst a Question , how you guys deal with Intervals at Rowerg?
I mean , when i uploaded from COncept2 , INtervals.icu , dont “read” rest intervals, so i.e 50min training only is 30min , and i nerver get HRR calculated , because i never get the “rest” - ( And my Garmin Watch dont pull the rowing meters/Watts , so or i have the entire workout and HR , or Only Meters and Watts ) Any advice ?
I’m not using Rowerg (I have a WaterRower w/ a SmartRow pulley), so I can’t give you any specific advice. My rest interval are always “active rest” and my device reads them as low Watt work intervals. I would reach out to @david to determine the best way to work with Intervals when dealing with how Rowerg treats rowing rest intervals.
I use the zones on this rowing erg calculator on the CrewLAB website as a nice simple starting point. Concept2 Erg Calculator - CrewLAB
Yes that sucks a bit about the rest section of intervals not being recorded correctly with the ERGdata app. This used to mess up my automatic CP calculations, especially in WKO5, when for example the 330w I finished an interval with would show to be held continuously on a solid line through the following minutes of rest while I was laying on the floor grasping for air. So I just don’t use that function at all any more and either program each interval including rest individually with the rest setting always kept on zero. And since I don’t have any complex workouts I often use the “just row” to record one continuous block and perform the workouts from memory.
Just found this thread so not sure if anyone is still interested, but as a rower/triathlete/coach I’ve looked into this a lot.
Two papers which I haven’t seen anyone link to yet:
As a rule of thumb I’ve seen people use +20-40w on the bike. There is also a great post on slowtwitch discussing Cam Wurf, where the Princeton lightweight coach (though I can’t find it now) gives the average % difference for his squad.
I also just found this thread… 100% endorse using power zones vs HR zones as a masters rower who primarily focuses on fall head races.
Any chance anyone has looked into this with NK EmPower Oarlock?
I’ve found that my on the water (OTW) power is considerably lower than other power measures (peloton, C2 bike erg, c2 row erg) considerably more than the “15% less” on the Empower website.
@SanderS is who I would ask………
Power in rowing has proven to be quite a difficult metric to master.
There are definitely devices on the market that measure power when rowing outdoors, with NK EmPower oarlocks being probably the most accessible. But results never seem to be really satisfying due to the biomechanical complexity of the movement in relation to both the shell and to the water. Real world examples show that in crew boats the same rower tends to have variations in power output on different positions in the boat that can’t be fully explained. Even when rowing in a single you would have to measure power on both oarlocks to have something of an indication of the applied power due to slight differences in arc and power application between the sides.
Power in indoor rowing is probably a bit easier to handle, although that’s almost always a derivation of the deceleration of the flywheel and never a real wattage. At least it’s consistent. I would always set zones independently for rowing and never transfer those from cycling. Not even with a (linear) correction. For myself the power in the lower zones might actually not differ too much between rowing and cycling, but I would never ever be able to hold numbers that I can do on the bike for longer durations on the indoor rower.
In practise I tend to think that speed and heart rate in relation to your stroke rate tell you everything you need to know. Physiologically speaking, that is. Rowing also has a big technical component where devices as the NK EmPower oarlocks can be very useful. But I figure that’s way beyond the scope of this thread…
Hey, I’ve got one (NK Empower) on my 1x, I also find it comes up more than 15% short, but I think this is probably accurate. The last time I did a 2k on the erg, I could barely see for the last 500m, definitely wasn’t rowing full slide, was very much yanking the handle to my chin etc. I’d say for comparison between erg and water I believe both are precise enough for usefulness, and accurate enough at what they measure - same as difference between my 4iiii power metre and Quarq power metre, if someone asks me my 20min PB I’ll go with the one that reads 10w higher, but ultimately I know what to aim for on each one.
Hello, how are you? How do you define your zones for rowing?
I’m asking because for rowing and skiing, my HR zones, even power, are completely off based on my RPE, as if I had to do RPE 1-2 at most to stay within the Easy “zone.” on HR
It’s as if it’s the first time you start cycling, everything is high, so over time the body adapts to the new stimulus.
I’m asking this, but I’m not new to rowing and skiing (5+ years). However, my HR is always “high,” compared to the perceived RPE
